kiwi_lady ([info]kiwi_lady) wrote in [info]katsucon,
  • Mood: sad
A little post I posted on the Katsucon Forum about the Artist Alley rules.

Dear Katsucon Artist Alley


I represent the group, Plastic Candy.
We have a question to the reasons why we were rejected from the Katsucon Artist table.

l Selling or reselling commercial merchandise is prohibited within the Artist Alley. Artists cannot sell or resell materials that can be bought in the Dealers room or in a store.

All the items we sell are HAND CRAFTED, and are not purchased through retails or any other means.

l  Artist Alley is intended for amateur artists working in a print/paper medium. It is also intended for artists who make 3D renditions of their own art or 3D renditions of licensed Anime characters. In that spirit, artists are required to use 75% or more of their table space for such art.

It is said that the AA is also a place for hand crated 3D renditions of their arts. I believe my items are not in violation of these rules.

Cat ears= pattern drafted / made with hands by Plastic Candy
Lolita bands= designed / made by Plastic Candy
Gothic and Cyber Punk accessories = sculpted shapes such as stars, buttons and others on pins, hand made by Plastic Candy
Hair clips= sculpted shapes on clips hand made by Plastic Candy
Key chains= key chains with shapes such as stars and anime characters in plush form, hand made by Plastic Candy
Earrings= earrings designed in Fruits Fashion, made by Plastic Candy.
Plushes= dolls of anime characters and original characters hand made by Plastic Candy
Doll outfits= Suited for BJDs, designed by Plastic Candy, and hand made by Plastic Candy
These items are the arts of Plastic Candy in a 3D form.
Also,
Portraits=Instant portraits drawn for buyers in Anime style, drawn by Plastic Candy
I strongly believe that the portraits are an original item in 2D paper/print medium.

If you would like pictures of them, we would gladly take them for you, even a progress picture to prove that these items are HAND crafted by us.

l Artists may not solely display and sell fan art. It is strongly suggested that fan art should not make up more than 25% of your table space. Fan art prints should be kept to 20 copies or less.

I believe items such as cat ears, Lolita bands, gothic Lolita bands, doll outfits and portraits are NOT a fan art in any category. They alone would make up the table up with more than 75% of the surface.

l Buttons, pins, hats, or t-shirts bearing the likeness of a licensed character are not allowed. Any such items bearing the artist’s original material are permitted.

Our pins, (hair pins) are not character pins. They are Fruit Styled items that contain shapes such as stars, flowers, and buttons. These pins would be our fashion portfolio type items.

l There can be no public display of sexually explicit or suggestive material without the proper checking of ID. If you are going to show adult material you MUST make sure the viewer shows proof of being 18+. This is solely the responsibility of the artist to do so, and as such, the artist will be held fully responsible for any failings to do so.

None of our items are 18+. Our items are accessories, 3D rendition of craft arts, and 2D images that would include portraits and our portfolios.
l Bootleg or knockoff items are prohibited. This includes, but is not limited to: CDs, DVDs, videos, posters, idol cards, and any unlicensed reproductions of any products actually released by an American company.

None of our items are bootlegs, or knock offs. If they were, they would be under the violation of the Japanese company copyrights, not the American company copyrights. In my understanding, Japanese copyrights do not affect items in America, unless they were copy righted by an American company.
In the Katsucon Artist Alley Rules, it is said that the AA is intended for artists who works in print/paper medium. However, it also says, "It is also intended for artists who make 3D renditions of their own art or 3D renditions of licensed Anime characters"
I have learned that Chii ears, from the anime Chobits, have also been banned. However, wouldn't the Chobits ear go under "3D renditions of licensed Anime characters”?
Although the Cosplay Chii ears were copyrighted by Cospa, it has not been done the same in the United States in my knowledge. Therefore, how would the artists be under the violation of the copyrights law if it weren’t copyrighted in the United States in the first place?
Also it is hard to find the reasoning to why cat ears at Katsucon Artist tables were banned. Unless the ears were copy righted, which I would find hard to do, since that would leave openings for people to copy right human body parts, I do not see the reason why cat ears should not be sold at the Katsucon table. Although they may seem similar, each artist’s rendition of these ears is very different. Every one of us drafts our own pattern to these ears with great effort. It seems bit insulting if the AA staffs saw them as the same, which would implicate that the AA staff does not understand the creativity that exists among arts, whether it be 3D or 2D arts.

l Copyright infringement laws are to be followed within the Artist Alley. It is the artist’s responsibility to make sure that their art does not violate copyright and must be able to prove it, if challenged.

I believe this part makes it hard for the artists such as us to understand what kind of items does not violate copyrights.
In the former statement, "3D renditions of licensed Anime characters" were allowed as long as they only made up 25% of the table. However, the term, license, seems to be too loosely defined here. By license, do you mean items licensed only in America?
How could the artists fill up 25% of their table with fan arts fan made anime character items if there is rule that prevents the artists to create copyrighted characters? This would rule out popular animation and game series for the artists, making the sales very difficult.

Art does not only mean inks and pencils. Art can be termed in different fields; quilting is an art, sculpting is an art, and even throwing a bucket of paint on a wall is considered an art. So why can’t handcraft and jewelry craft be considered as an art?

I respect the Katsucon most sincerely. However, I found some of the AA rules hard to understand, and I do not think that the Katsucon staffs gave enough information to why Plastic Candy table was rejected. However, Katsucon has every right to reject our request, and we completely respect your choice.
Thank you so much for putting this con together.
Have a happy holiday, and we wish to hear back from you soon.

---------------------------


I really have NO idea what they are trying to do by banning all hair accessories at Artist Allley tables...
Some sellers JUST sell cosplay hair products, such as cat ears..
I'm not demanding this, but it would've been nice if Katsucon gave a reason to WHY they are banning all hair accessories goods...
this would mean
NO chii ears
NO cat ears
NO animal ears whatsoever
NO lolita bands
NOTHING thats gonna sit on your head.
Please speak out at the Katsu forum to show your opinion on this matter.
Thank you.

http://forums.katsucon.org/viewtopic.php?t=1485

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  • 46 comments

[info]xyloart

December 15 2006, 02:45:36 UTC 5 years ago

I would like to know the same thing. I sell prints of my original art, buttons with my original art, hand made chokers designed by me, hand made hair accessories, and costume props that are 'zombie cures' and 'otaku cures' and stuff like that. I was told I could only sell the prints and the buttons, and everything else was 'inappropriate' for the AA. Considering I sold all of these items at Katsucon last year, and have sold them at Otakon and AnimeNext, I think a bit of reasoning behind why sewn items, props, and accessories are suddenly now not acceptable. They are 3D art, people like them, they're fun and creative, and totally the kind of stuff people expect to find in an alley. I don't have a bazillion of them to sell and I'd be out of place in the Dealer's Room, not to mention I could never afford to be there.

According to their own rules my stuff is fine as well, so I'm completely at a loss here. This is the main rule that I think is the problem:

Artist Alley reserves the right to refuse and turn away any artist selling solely fabrics, trinkets, and other merchandise not appropriate for Artist Alley.

First of all, why? Why are sewn items and 'trinkets' which I assume means cosplay props not acceptable? They're standard artist alley fare everywhere. Plus, my table is not even solely sewn items and props, yet they're still saying I can't bring any of those items.

I'm so let down. My accessories and props made up half of my profits, and I really count on making up table costs and hotel costs when I go to conventions; if I can't do that I don't know that I want to go. Nor am I sure that I want to participate in an alley that supports such a narrow definition of art...

[info]xyloart

December 15 2006, 02:46:31 UTC 5 years ago

*I think a bit of reasoning behind why sewn items, props, and accessories are suddenly now not acceptable is warranted

[info]kiwi_lady

5 years ago

[info]jessi_b

5 years ago

Deleted comment

[info]kiwi_lady

December 15 2006, 15:02:25 UTC 5 years ago

I know my group may have trouble going to Katsu now, and I think like you said, other artists may consider not going due to finantual difficulties and such. Its sad. we were looking forward going here.

[info]shawnatums

December 15 2006, 04:22:25 UTC 5 years ago

this is very disturbing to me as well

i am not an artist - but i ahve plenty of artist friends - and i tend to buy these "fabric art" peices at AAs.....

as a member of staff at the convention - i will try to find an answer for you all!

[info]kiwi_lady

December 15 2006, 14:47:44 UTC 5 years ago

Re: this is very disturbing to me as well

thank you very much! its glad to hear that a staff member is willing to listen to the concern of the people.

[info]quoththeraven

December 15 2006, 05:58:50 UTC 5 years ago

could you put this under a LJ cut? it's taking up a lot of space on my page-- i honestly think that the rules are fair and trying to get back to what Arist alley is about-- which is amateur artists and not as focused on making money from jewelry/fabrics that don't take much "artistic ability" to do-- it's more of a craft and should be kept to the dealers rooms. unless something is intricate and amazingly detailed (like hand sculpted pottery or intricately beaded chokers) i do not think it should have a place in AA.

[info]redneckotaku

December 15 2006, 12:59:40 UTC 5 years ago

Fannish Jewelery and Fabrics should be part of Artist Alley beause they are art pieces (in these cases). They are hand crafted original works in my opinion. I have seen these pieces at other shows Artist Alley and are some of the things I look at most when I am in an Artist Alley. The problem with telling these people to go to the Dealer's room is that there is no space in the Dealer's room.

[info]kiwi_lady

December 15 2006, 14:27:35 UTC 5 years ago

there is a major different between the dealer's and the artist alley (AA). While the dealers tables are
A. sold out
and
B. costs 350 dollar for a 4 x 6 table,
the AA is
A. not sold out
and
B. costs 30 dollar for 4 x 7 table
Also I don't think its fair that craft artists should have to compete with manufactured factory goods at much lower price at the dealer's room.
2D prints are not the only type of art in this world, and considering that, I believe that the craft artists does indeed belong in the Artist Alley.

PS. I 'll put this under cut :).

[info]lockemaison

December 15 2006, 18:04:41 UTC 5 years ago

That's bull. I'm a 2D artist and I'm all about that in AA and all cons. But I'd say an awful lot of crappy 2D artists that take the equivalent amount of effort on their crappy art as other people do on crappy 3D stuff. The opposite is true, good 3D stuff takes creativity and "artistic skill", that includes jewelry, fabrics and etc and they take the same care and skill (in a different format of course) as a good 2D artist.

I certainly couldn't do what those folks do. I know, I've tried. Personally I wouldn't buy any of it anyway. I'm only interested in 2D art, but that doesn't make me or you right for saying those guys aren't artists or skilled. Us 2D artists are NOT superior to craft artists.

My only qualm is people make something at least anime-related. For instance, I don't think the people that just make chain mail or weapons should be there. Some of those people just aren't hiding at all the fact that they have nothing to do with anime. I can understand if katsucon's trying to make people like that go away. But if someone is making home-made anime-related 3D stuff, they should be allowed. My 2D art is home-made, fan-created art made in respect to anime. So is that 3D stuff.

In fact, I think the prevalence of these 3D artists separates and makes superior anime con artist alleys to other types of con alleys.

Anonymous

5 years ago

[info]lunaaislin

December 15 2006, 17:26:55 UTC 5 years ago

#1 If you don't like katsucons policies don't attend their convention period... its just that simple.
#2 If you are going to Katsucon to be an artist than get a table and do art. If you are going to sell your items you need to buy a vendors room table.

Basically it sounds to me like you are trying to be a vendor without incurring the cost of a vendor table. Conventions have rules like this in place for that very reason. Certainly if you were a vendor selling custom cosplay items you wouldn't want to have to compete with someone in artist alley who tried to skirt around the regulations and paid 20X less for their table.

Be an adult. You need to understand that if you want to run a business you will have overhead. If you don't understand this basic principal you have no business attempting to make sales. I think people are lucky to be able to sell anything in artist alley at all. I feel unfortunate for all of you if the state ever catches wind of this and comes to check if you all have valid business licences & sales tax certificates.

[info]kiwi_lady

December 15 2006, 17:45:39 UTC 5 years ago

So by your statements, all the grandmothers/mothers who sell their homemade quilts at craft fair should take their hand made items to the mall and sell next to Bed and Beyond?
Unlike the dealer's, most of the AA artists are NOT in to this as their CAREER. Unlike the dealers, we don’t have contracts to oversea areas that let’s us buy 100 cat ears for 2 dollars.
So please don’t compare hobby vs. job.
There is a difference.

The artists design their own items, and HAND CRAFTS them, unlike the dealers who buys them at mass quantities.

So in your own opinion, WHAT qualifies as an "art" :)?
if paper and pen are it, then.. you have a LOOONG way to go lol

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]xyloart

December 15 2006, 17:50:07 UTC 5 years ago

As con attendees we have a right to express our opinions on the convention. It's not as simple as just not attending. We care about the convention and we don't want to see it's quality degraded. And art is not limited to prints; selling hand made items does not mean you should have to be inthe vendor's room.

It sounds to me that you have no understanding of the difference between those who sell in the Vender's room (companies selling mass produced licensed material in the form of prints and items) and those who sell in the Alley (artists representing themselves, selling in small quantities of hand made goods and original/fan art).

And guess what? You do have to have sales tax licenses to sell, and most of us do! It is required by law and most all conventions require that you get one. The states all have procedures for temporary sales tax licenses for those selling their goods and services. And also, you do not need a valid busines s licence to sell items. If you do not register your business, you are by default a 'sole proprietor', which is perfectly legal. When I file my taxes that is what I file my business income under and there are no problems.

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]xyloart

5 years ago

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]xyloart

5 years ago

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

Deleted comment

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]lunaaislin

December 15 2006, 17:32:03 UTC 5 years ago

Ad an additional note Artist Alley is for displaying art not selling art. Thats why they don't call it Vendors Room (HEY WAIT! DON'T THEY HAVE SOMETHING LIKE THAT?!) The rules do not state that you cannot display your items they state that you cannot SELL them.

[info]xyloart

December 15 2006, 17:43:02 UTC 5 years ago

The Artist Alley is for selling art. And no, you cannot display the items either. Even bringing them is grounds for being ejected from the alley; I was told this by Tex, the department head.

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]xyloart

5 years ago

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]kiwi_lady

December 15 2006, 17:47:26 UTC 5 years ago

Artist alley is not JUST to display arts, that’s why they don’t call it the art show (HEY WAIT, WE DO HAVE SOMETHING LIKE THAT!!).


PS. btw im 17 : ))). I'm not legally an adult XDDDDDD. I'll "act like one" when I DO become one alright? cool XD

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]kiwi_lady

5 years ago

Deleted comment

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

Deleted comment

[info]lunaaislin

December 15 2006, 18:30:50 UTC 5 years ago

They should take vendors room and artist alley combine them and give each person their own individual room and title so that everyone will be happy. You try to accommodate the artist and the vendors whine you try to accommodate the vendors and the artist whine. I swear its a lose lose situation.

Deleted comment

[info]lunaaislin

5 years ago

[info]lockemaison

December 15 2006, 19:24:09 UTC 5 years ago

to katsucon

You know what this is like, Katsucon? One time I was at SDCC watching Blue Gender the Movie. We are literally 70+ minutes into this and the head anime track guy comes storming in going "why is this being shown in English?" Picks up the remote, changes it to Japanese with english subtitles and people start yelling it's too late and some people want English etc. SDCC is a multi-genre con dedicated to helping introduce geekdom to normal people, so non-anime fans are probably in the room. He yells "this is going to be in Japanese and if you don't like it you can leave!" Personally I prefer Japanese but that's not the point. The point is some anime snob forced his ideas of what he thinks anime should be onto everyone else. But whatever. Because a bunch of us walked out after that. That's what this is. Someone up there in Katsu-land is being a child. Someone thinks anime convention artists should be traditional 2D artists.

This isn't about competing with vendors. These are home-made crafts, not resold manufactured items. This is about someone not liking crafts. I can understand limits, but the rules are written badly. Someone give me a good, legal, rational reason for not allowing home-made anime-related crafts & trinkets *other* than personal preference on the part of the convention. If it's good, I will agree to it, because I truly am curious.

I'm not taking the time to register for some con forum to post this there, and I'm not going to read it either. So someone can quote me.

[info]lunaaislin

December 16 2006, 00:47:13 UTC 5 years ago

Re: to katsucon

I agree that their rules should be clearly posted and they should be rational justifiable reasons. I think asking for such logic from a convention is like trying to squeeze water from a stone. The chairmans outlook on these things generally is "I know whats best for the fans this is my convention and we are doing things my way" now I don't mean specifically the Katsucon Chairman but Chairmen in general seem to have that viewpoint even as staff members we can rarely change their opinions about things. I have staffed 4 conventions for several years and this is just based on my opinion. I don't personally make rules unless it something I can justify when people come asking but your dealing with people that do not have any such respect for you.

Anonymous

December 20 2006, 03:36:42 UTC 5 years ago

Anonymous

December 20 2006, 03:37:22 UTC 5 years ago

Anonymous

December 20 2006, 03:38:01 UTC 5 years ago

Anonymous

December 20 2006, 03:38:36 UTC 5 years ago

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